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Gern Blanston's avatar

My responses to this are too short. I’ll try not to be glib, or curt, or sarcastic.

Hamas & Fatah make war in the same manner that Nazi Germany & Soviet Russia did. The Nazis (and the Japanese) were completely defeated and remade from the ground up because, at long last, they prefered peace on our terms to war on our terms. That’s what must happen to Hamas & Fatah. If you emulate the tactics of Nazis & Communists, you should be treated like them.

Execellent note on Roman methods of war. They viewed every war as an existential war of national survival. They made deserts and called them “peace”. Every Jew was expelled from Jerusalem for centuries.

There was forgiveness and national reconciliation after our Civil War. Too many people have forgotten, or are ignorant of, the vast number of Americans killed.

Monsterous acts were committed during that war & forgiven.

Gregory Engel's avatar

In my experience there are many kinds of forgiveness. And I can acknowledge that "forgiveness is what happens when love meets justice" is a kind of forgiveness. It's new to me, though. You've given me something to think about.

I believe there can be forgiveness without love or justice. I forgave my father long ago for the abuses he leveled against his children. But it was not out of love (except perhaps self-love) and I certainly was not expecting any justice. What he got was my complete and utter indifference.

I think, too, that forgiveness is directional. Someone wrongs me and I can forgive them without them ever knowing I have done so. In that case it's something I do for myself. It releases me from the burden of anger or having to plot some sort of revenge and suffer the consequences. It frees me where as that asshole is still an asshole. Is it love that has protected both of us from harm? I don't know. Was there Justice? Perhaps. Seeking forgiveness with justice might make the quest a fool's errand, doing little more than fuel a vicious cycle.

Also, the teaspoon is already lost.

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